I'm just learning the ropes, but am wondering if anyone has any experience using a Challenger with the new spray tank that comes with the Max?

Does the extra weight put too much stress on a 3/4 HP motor? Does it make it harder to work with the Challenger, et cetera.

Any feedback is appreciated.

Rand

On a similar note, I'd be interested in hearing from anybody who has a new Max who can share thoughts, opinions, etc.

I have to admit that, despite being a Challenger distributor, I have yet to acquire a Challenger Max, mainly because I am storage space-challenged. I'm going to have to put up a shed or something, unless Challenger comes up with a covering comparable to those that some people use to cover up their sport cars with. I doubt that it makes the Challenger any more difficult to work with, as there are now 2 large wheels ON THE FLOOR while the machine is working, not just for rolling it to and from the jobsite. This takes a great deal of pressure off of the pad driver, yet still leaving enough to clean carpet effectively. It is the same concept as with the Cimex and Orbitec CX line of machines. PLus, the Challenger Max comes with a one hp motor.

Chris Watson has some info on the Max at her new blog - www.challengerop.blogspot.com.

It is possible to install the tank & spray system on a standard sized Challenger, but I don't think I would do this with only the half hp motor.

I have no idea what size motor I have on my Orbitec machine, but they have a spray system and tank that usually comes with the machine, and I have had nobody complain about the motor being too small to run the tank when it's full. I was just too cheap to buy the spray system.

I imagine the Challenger is fine with this since it has a 1hp motor.

If you have the Orbitec CX models (sold elsewhere as "The Brute"), the CX-17 (15" pad driver) has a 3/4 hp motor. The CX-20 (17" pad driver) (the one I have) has a 1.0 hp motor.

I talked to Mr. Lancaster about a cx and he informed me you do not and have never carried his line of equipment Mark, I know I have noticed you stating now and on previous occasions that you sell his equipment.

Further, he stated the cx and the brute that ccs sells are not the same at all, but that they have different orbitheads and brushes.

Alan

I'm a little confused. I've had an arrangement with Clark to sell his machines for about a year and a half. I recently sold 2 CX-20s to a maintenance/janitorial company in Memphis TN. Clark e-mailed me just today giving me updated info on Orbitec's new Defender model. I don't sell a lot of Orbitecs, but I am very much authorized to do so by Clark himself, and have done, and he has sent me the commission checks to which I was entitled.

After bringing the above assertions of "Alan Star" to the attention of Clark Lancaster (owner of Orbitec) he very strongly denied ever having had such a discussion, whether with an "Alan Star" or with anyone else. People who have been following this Forum from the beginning may recall that there were several visits and bogus posts a while back from an individual who is primarily a distributor of Orbitec equipment, although he gives them different names on his own website. This was at a time when I only dealt with Challenger's machines, and the essence of his comments was how much better HIS (Orbitec's) machines were than Challenger's. At that time he was posting under the name of Jason Travis, and of course he denied vehemently that he was you-know-who just as he no doubt will this time, as Alan Star. Many old-timers in the industry who know everyone by even their writing style agreed, and posted here that, of course, Jason Travis was you-know-who. So go ahead again Alan/Jason, sweear up and down who you aren't, and the rest of us will look on in amusement.

The ccs machines are different than the orbitec's as mentioned above: the pad driver and counterbalance are different. But they are both made by Clark/orbitec. Thanks for clarifying your relationship with orbitec though Mark.

I've been wondering about the new orbitec machines called the "defender". They aren't on the orbitec website, but I've seen pictures of them posted somewhere a few months back. It appeared that there were two pad drivers to choose from.

Do you have any information on these machines as far as weight, specs and prices? Maybe we could start another thread for this??

I received an e-mail from Clark at Orbitec about an hour ago, in which he told me that the Defender is now on his site at www.orbitecsolutions.com. As with all other Orbitecs, I will sell it at 10% below the factory price.

Good grief! "You know who" sure seems to be getting around.

"Alan", come back and talk more


--- Derek.

"Alan Star" dose sound made up. Mark I checked out the defender on orbitecs site, and the pad driver looks very different than any thing else I have ever seen. Are there any benifits to this driver that others don't have? Just curious.

I think Clark has 2 different pad drivers available for his machines. I've seen Clark post pictures somewhere of both of them. The other one is mostly velcro with a small ring of brushes around the outer edge. This one would have a VERY low profile with the whole pad driver being roughly level with the brush cup--actually the brush cup is part of the pad driver it appears.

One of the pad drivers (I've read somewhere) is better with the thicker "bonnet" type pads, tuways, microfiber, maybe the green, brown or black striped bonnets too. The other is better with the thin pads. I'm not sure which is which. I imagine Mark or Clark at Orbitec could get you information about them when/if needed.

I would not be shocked if "Alan Star" is the Big guy himself in disguise, its his way. I would never, ever do business with the big guy, but that is another very, very long story.

There are 2 different pad drives to the Defender and CX line. I know, I just picked up a 17" Defender and CX-20 yesterday and Clark had both pad drivers available, both on brush cups 1-blue stiff bristles and 1-hard plastic velcro-like material (its like our Malish driver for a high speed buffer). Different pads work better with one driver than the other. I had some fun working with both of them today after my regular cleaning.

Clark is a great guy to work with and I HIGHLY recommend the CX and Defender models, just buy them from Mark. We have tried every model out there, except the Challenger Max, and I think the Defender/CX series is the best with the Challenger following at a close 2nd.

I like having the wheels in constant contact. it makes operating the OP machine very, very easy for beginners (and those of us who don't want to wand again!). The Defender is better in residential and the CX-20 for commercial. The CX spray system is very well designed and the new tanks w/caps are perfect.

As far as the 'Brute'/CX-20 & 'EasyGlide'/Defender, the 'Brute'/'EasyGlide' use a different Drive Block (brush/velcro with a wood base if I remember correctly) with require the orbital counterbalace system to be balanced to work correctly with the drive block; and of course they come in red versus the gray finish. **Of course the comments from 'Alan Star' sound very close to what the Big Guy says when confronted with the truth.

And just so you don't think I am a shill, I don't distribute anything for anybody. I recently got back into the family business after having been out of it for more than 8 years. I still kept up with developments duirng those years and still tried out new equipment as it came in.

Scott,

are you Ray's old man?

--- Derek.

LOL! Can't be. There's nobody older than Ray. Scott must be his son.

I agree with what Scott said.

Like I do with what his super old Dad says.

Ray is the older one (72) and I am the better looking one (43).

Scott

Scott,

what do you prefer for commercial: CX20 or Cimex --- and why?

i love my Cimex and the results it gives, but am always looking for any advantage.

thanx for the feedback --- Derek.

Cimex vs CX-20---I prefer the CX-20 for 3 reasons

1. Client impression. Back to "where does the dirt go?". With the pad under the CX-20 you can show where the dirt goes. Yes, I know that it doesn't remove all of the soil, but it makes a big difference just getting out some/most of the soil with the pad. Plus, no 'black sock' syndrome to worry about.

2. No fuzzies to vacuum up. It seems that the current crop of scrub pads for the Cimex tend to shred over the carpet. The last few times we used the Cimex, we had to vacuum them up, it look so un-professional.

3. We ran the Cimex and CX-20 side by side last weekend. I give a slight speed advantage to the CX-20, but keep in mind, we have a lot of experience with the Cimex. Given more time with the CX-20, I expect to the become noticeably faster than the Cimex in maintenece situations. Also, give the agility edge to the CX-20, feels lighter and it easier to manuver around tight spots.

Scott, what "pads" do you use under your CX-20?

Pads--

For Commercial Maint., Tuways Thin Ones

For Residential Gladiator and Cotton

I am waiting on the next big set of new type of pads from Vietnam to try.

You and me both.

Waiting and waiting and waiting ...

Did Orbitec say about when they might be getting them?

thanx for the feedback Scott

i guess the only way for me to compare the 2 is to see a CX20 in action. it's hard for me to get a true comparison via the 'net, when 99% of Cimex users are using a vct-type floor pad. i don't. since i am using a Tuway pad (not ThinOne) on my Cimex, i may be getting the same/similar results as you with a CX20 and Tuway.

i think it really boils down to: is the rotation / counter rotation of the 3 Cimex heads causing more agitation than the oscillation of an OP machine. both the Cimex and the CX20 weigh similar, so you're getting roughly the same lb's of pressure on the carpet.


thanx again --- Derek.