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Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

I couldn't agree more. The proposed scheme at this junction is absolutely stupid.
This is currently a fairly free-flowing junction, despite the volume of traffic that uses it, and the proposed changes can only result in heavier tailbacks of traffic in Golborne Road and make a right turn into Golborne Road from Bolton Road more hazardous.
The explanations given by Engineering Department would be laughable if they didn't come from such underlying dangerously muddled thinking.

As for the trees outside the church: the arguement that reducing visibility at a junction will improve safety just doesn't stand up. Half a brain can see that.
Engineering Department seem to believe that "Greater hazard = better road safety" -I'd like to see the argue that one in court after an accident at this junction results in the drivers involved taking action against the council for contributory negligence.
It is to be hoped that the church has the sense to refuse to allow any planting on their land that results in a more hazardous junction. If they allow it they also could be held to be negligent.

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

This is currently a fairly free-flowing junction, despite the volume of traffic that uses it,

I certainly wouldn't call it free flowing at peak times!

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Coming from the chairman of a very large estate association in Stubshaw Cross with many car owners who will be affected by these stupid proposals that is not a very constructive comment to make. do we conclude you are for the changes then?

Town: stubshie

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Hi
Firstly, to reply to Ray's comments regarding Juliens posting, the answer is in his posting as I read it. No, he doesn't agree with it

"certainly wouldn't call it free flowing at peak times!"
That no way implies he wants to make it worse, just being constructive.

As for this junction , the comments made re sight lines and trees plus road narrowing all seem pertinant to me.

To return to Juliens comment, surely this is an ideal sight for a mini rounabout. Traffic coming up Bolton Road would have the right of way over traffic coming down and would let traffic out of Golborne Rd into Ashton. This should with yellow boxed junctions keep the traffic moving in a safe manner.

Also when it is not rush hour would have a traffic calming measure.

AND NOW FOR THE REAL GOODY FOR ALL COMMUNITY CHARGE PAYERS...IT WILL BE CHEAPER AND TAKE LESS TIME TO INSTALL.

Finally as with "Gary Wilkes Bryn Online" in Bryn, "Nigel Ash's Blog" in Ashton has shown the benefit to the community of using this modern form of communication. Thanks to both councillors.

Alan

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Alan. Your are obviously better than I am at `reading between the lines` re. what Julian thinks. However I cannot see how a mini-roundabout would improve thingsbecause ten times more traffic goes down to Ashton than those turning right into Golborne Rd. but a roundaboutwould surely give priority to a single car turning right and may cause a whole line of traffic to stop dead wheras as of now they keep flowing and yes I realise the cars turning left out of Golborne Rd. would get the chance to nip out in front but how often have you seen three cars at three different points on a roundabout all stop a once waiting for each other and then all start at once thinking it was their turn? I am always seeing and doing that.The cheapest thing is to leave it as it is and do what I`ve started doing more often..Catch a bus.

Town: stubshie

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

I agree that a mini-roundabout would be a sensible idea. It would help to slow traffic on Bolton Road, aid traffic turning right into Golborne Road and allow people to turn right out of Golborne Road.

I think that the Hilton Street/Bolton Road junction would also benefit from a mini-roundabout. Cars turning right out of Hilton Street have difficulty seeing traffic coming up Bolton Road from the town centre if there is standing traffic going into the town.

As you state, these would be relatively low-cost measures to improve the junctions and would probably be more effective.

Town: Ashton

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Ray,

Firstly you conclude incorrectly sir, as Mr Edwards has very kindly pointed out. Secondly the fact I am Chair of a "Very Large Estate Association" which I am not, I am Chair of "Tenants And Residents Association" for two estates. Back to the point instead of misconstruing things, The junction is DEFINITELY NOT free flowing at peak times with traffic backed down Bolton Road, sometimes all the way back to Bamfurlong. That Junction has always been a problematic one, And a very dangerous road to cross coming from St Luke's to The Carpet shop at Golborne Road. And the same applies to crossing in front of the soon to be Heritage Garden, across Bolton Road.

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Julian. can you stop battling with me about what you did or didn`t say ? that`s not important.
What is important is whether thes proposals will make that junction better or not . those first two posters stated quite a few truths and we should work together to first of all agree on what would be best and if we disagree with this survey then we must oppose it strongly....but only those of us who will be affected by it should air their views. and that`s me and you for a start plus every car owner in Stubshie and further afield who use that junction...Over to you..

Town: stubshie

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

The Ballad of East and West

Rudyard Kipling (1865–1936)


OH, East is East, and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God’s great Judgment Seat;
But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
When two strong men stand face to face, tho’ they come from the ends of the earth!

Town: in between

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

"Julian. can you stop battling with me about what you did or didn`t say ? that`s not important."

Clearly it is important otherwise you wouldnt have raised the issue. And I am not battling with you I have nor the need nor the intention.

The problem with the junction needs addressing, as has been said previously reducing any visibility is borderline crimial behaviour, and will no doubt end up resulting in further "Rear Shunts". A pedestrian island seems a very good idea for the pedestrians.

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

OK. So lets get comstructive.Let`s all make a sketch of the junction as it is now.and how it would be as the surveyor wants it in NIGEL ash`s blog and also with a roundabout and list all the scenarios.Then perhaps someone can tell me when the last shunt occurred because I have never heard of one in all the 46 years I have lived here. Nor have I ever seen a vehicle exit Golborne Rd. without stopping first. Nor have I ever heard of someone being knocked down at that junction,and in all the hundreds of times since my schooldays that I have walked past that junction have I had any problem doing so. I am not saying none of these thihg have actually happened but I am simply saying I have never heard of it. So if anyone can come forward with more experience of that junction than I have then let them correct me.But I think that altering that junction will make it worse for all of us who use it. And I have sent an e-mail to the surveyor to that effect.

Town: stubshie

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Hi Ray et al

As I See It

As it is now there are lenghty delays going into Ashton up to Bolton Road and Golborne Road, morning and evening. As a result adjoining roads are used as a "rat run". Also due to the delays some drivers albeit foolishly take risks.

The proposed alterations appear to be designed to slow traffic down. This along with the narrowing should help pedestrians, at the moment it is unsafe to cross, due to width and the excessive amount of information the driver has to take on board.
However the alterations will although making the road narrower negate this benefit by placing on the motorist etra intake of infomation. It will also slow trafic down and lead to gridlock in the adjoining streets.

A mini roundabout uses the flowing water theory. What Ray said about motorists arriving at the same time and all sitting there does happen, generally when there is moderate to low traffic only.

The mini roundabout also has the advantage of very low capital outlay and can be reversed without great financial loss, if it does prove unviable.

I think there may well be an hidden agenda that has not been raised. The "Flagship Scheme" in Ashton town centre may well cause worse delays at peak times in the town entre. Slowing the influx of traffic from the north may smooth this out. If traffic flows quicker at Bolton/Golborne Roads this may cause the congestion that currently is worse between Bamfurlong/Golborne Road to spread all the way to the Town centre.

Alan

Alan

Town: Bryn

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

I cant make out if Ray is for or against the alterations i do know that whats happening in Ashton has not got a thing to do with this alteration as the gridlock has been happening for the last 5 plus years at peak traffic time. Why dont you go all the way Ray and slow the traffic lights at Bryn road down and allow the traffic you say is going into Ashton be made lighter. More than 40% of which turn up Bryn road south another junction that gets gridlocked at peak times. Leave well alone and just put a padestrian island just inside Golborne road.NO TREES AS THIS WILL ONLY CAUSE ACCIDENTS TO HAPPEN AS DRIVERS COMEING FROM STUBSHAWW CROSS WOULD NOT SEE CARS IN GOLBORNE ROAD AND THE SAME THE OTHER WAY. Make the junction a "STOP" out of Golborne roaD INSTEAD OF A GIVE WAY THIS THEN SHOULD STOP ALL THE BOY RACERS WHO WOULD BE BREAKING THE LAW IF THEY JUST WENT STRIGHT THROUGH THE JUNCTION FROM GolborneRoad!!

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

To Very Angry. I don`t know who you are or where you live but for you to state that you don`t know whether I am for or against suggests to me that you need to go to specsavers lol. Please re-read my last thread. I am totally against ANY change at that junction at all. As I suggested Alan, draw a sketch of your mini-island and show the added pedestrian island and then visualize 10 cars travelling down Bolton Rd. to Ashton. say 3 carswanting to turn right into Golborne Rd. 3 cars wanting to turn left out of Golborne Rd. 3 pedestrians standing 0n your little island waiting to cross the second half and finally a 38 ton artic wanting to turn right out of Golborne Rd. Tell me what you would be watching for if you were the artic driver or how safe you would feel standing on that island... and that`s a scenario that does happen. and I still say EVERYBODY stops at the white line in Golborne Rd. And back to Very Angry take your memory back to before the lights went up at the Bryn Rd. junction and tell me that we used to have the queues that we have now? I think not.... The only benifit those lights give is to drivers turning out of Bryn Rd. for which I am constantly thankful. I beleive that altering the junction in any way added to the debacle that will be Ashton town centre will make Bolton Rd. a long thin carpark .....

Town: stubshie

Re: Re: Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commi

Sorry Ray i got you mixed up with the previous writer who was sitting on the fence. I dont need to go to specsavers to know that the lights at bryn road only moved the traffic down the road 300yards to Bryn Road South a great feat of engineering planning. Also you say you cant remember any shunts on this junction i'm sorry to have to tell you a young child was knocked down by a HGV at this junction less than3 years ago.and i suggest you go look in the gutter at the smashed reflecters from drivers changeing their mind at the last min and the person behind still looking up Bolton Road smashing into them. I can give the names of at least 2 people who this has happened to in the past 12 months.We shouldn't be falling out with ourselves as its making the whole debarcle look petty when the suggestions are criminal and will lead to most certainly a death. The junction should have as the highway code says a SOLID WHITE LINE NOT A BROKEN ONE THAT MEANS THE VEHICLE HAS TO PHISICALLY STOP AT THE JUNCTON BEFORE PULL OUT
Its Wigan MBC we should be argueing with not ourselves.ASHTON TOWN CENTRE JUST PROVES IT.

Town: 56 years an Ashtoner.

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Was I sitting on the fence "VERY ANGRY"?

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Is it any wonder the people at Wigan MBC treat ashtoners the way they do when all they can do is make petty arguments on a web site THATS IT DONE PLAYING WITH CHILDREN BACK TO THE REAL WORLD you deserve one another on this site.

Town: ASHTON

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Instead of living behind a pseudonym, why not put your proper name to be taken seriously?

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Is this so drastic? Do you all feel qualified to draw a sketch to take on WMBC in a drawing competition? Very angry I detect a sense of horse play from you with your manner of getting a message across.

Town: cos de sol Ashton

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Another pseudonym!!

Town: Ashton

Re: Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Listen all you people. This is serious. If we let them go ahead without a proper and compelling argument against the proposed changes WE the people of Stubshaw Cross in particular, and all the other junction users will have to live with what the Metro.give us just like Ashton town centre and Bryn Rd. lights. I personally am sick to death of looking out of my window at a solid block of cars and HGV`s throwing their smelly fumes at my house and watching it get worse year after year..Where are our councillors in all this?They get paid to listen to us...Or are they living too far away to hear us, or care!!

Town: stubshie

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Why destroy when we could create,
Keep the peace, erase the hate.

Normal Community West High School
Normal, IL, US

*********************************

If only PEACE were understood,
What couldn’t be now, in the future could.

Milwaukee German Immersion School
Milwaukee, WI, US

Town: Everywhere

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Pax,

You obviously have access to a good collection of sayings, probably for all situations. But do you ever actually say anything that comes from your own original thought.

A lively debate such as this one doesn't need a trickle of platitudes from the sidelines. They don't help they just irritate, the opposite of what I think you are trying to achieve.

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Quite often, but under my own name, what is yours?
***
I know a funny little man,
As quiet as a mouse.
He does the mischief that is done
In everybody's house.
Though no one ever sees his face,
Yet one and all agree
That every plate we break, was cracked
By Mr. Nobody
*****
Laugh and the world laughs with you weep and you weep alone.
*****
Writing styles are like handwriting,
************
Who am I? This or the other?
Am I one person today and tomorrow another?
Am I both at once? A hypocrite before others,
And before myself a contemptibly woebegone weakling?
Or is something within me still like a beaten army,
Fleeing in disorder from victory already achieved?
Who am I? They mock me, these lonely questions of mine.
Whoever I am, Thou knowest, 0 God, I am Thine!
*****
A Soul Not Thy Own
Tears of anger burn my flesh, like a candles wax sliding down the shaft. I have only myself to blame for this.
by DarkVail

Peace again Mr Angry

Town: Everywhere

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

Thanks for your contribution, Pax. Too much anger, I agree.

Town: Ashton

Re: To all people who live on estates off Golborne Road,& stubshaw cross residence commity

I dont want to be one that points out spelling mistakes but in this case I think it is relevant.

By saying " residence commity " does the author mean Stubshaw Cross Residents Group?

Can anyone point me in the direction of any details of this proposal apart from the sketchy outline given on N Ash blog?